I lost $200 on a gun that had less then 1000 rounds through it but I could care. I dont own a Glock or a SIG and am not a fanboy of either. I just separate Shatner the man from Kirk the character, which he plays with Shakespearian operatic perfection. 19 Feb 2021 Military.com | By Matthew Cox A former U.S. Marine and federal agent has filed a $10 million lawsuit against Sig Sauer Inc. alleging that his holstered Sig P320 -- a pistol. Second, your claim that the military is dumping because theyre problematic? Ive seen similar situations at our Municipal range. The Milwaukee Police Department reports "multiple unexplained accidental discharges" of the Sig Sauer P320 9mm, a gun all officers are required to carry, making for more than 1,600 firearms. On Thursday, M.D. Sig Sauer P320 (Christine Peterson/TNS) February 22, 2021 Ryan Morgan Gunmaker Sig Sauer is facing a new lawsuit from a U.S. federal agent who claims his holstered P320 pistol discharged without him pulling the trigger and struck him in his upper right hip. He is acting as a consultant in the Collette suit that was filed last week. He said there has to be something wrong with the gun if this is happening to individuals with this amount of training, this amount of skill.. Maybe in South America a poor military did, but thatd be about it. Or you would have to have enough slide play for the slide movement to physically disengage the sear and striker leg mating surfaces. Sig fanboys are almost as bad as Glock fanboys. 00:03. For instance theres Lieutenant Thomas Ahern who was was performing a routine function (test) of his P320 when it fired at him without any force towards the trigger, resulting in the bullet impacting his left thigh.. Sig Sauer's P320 is widely used by police departments across the country, and is a big seller in the civilian market, with about half a million sold nationwide. The heads up testing was immediately finished the Sig was the winner. Theres still the P938 extractors snapping they refuse to acknowledge. Neither argument is relevant or very intelligent and certainly not useful. Then either the gun somehow managed to magically clear both the broken tab and foreign body to continue to operate. Just 3 days ago, a Florida Corrections recruit killed herself by a negligent discharge during firearms training. How many times does a pistol have to malfunction before you blame it? Anyway around here they do. Sound familiar? Glock's and Sig P320 are all designated as Double-Action-Only fire control mechanisms. Rather, it's because those LEO P320 pistols are seeing much more physical action than ones carried by civilians. The investigation revealed the use of an incorrect holster not designed for a [SIG] P320, said the statement, which was released Friday and posted to a U.S. online pro-industry publication, Soldier Systems. Still waiting. The guys at the LGS saw only one broken striker but it confirmed what the manager who had the P320 go off and my thoughts. The Collette suit, for example, lists 39 such discharges, all but five of which involved law enforcement officers. Covid ruined that gravy train for him but hes still doing the conventions. Because its flat out bull**it. Where is this lightning striking twice? Using an example from the first prong, we legitimately fault the user who shot himself in the palm, rightfully asking why in the WORLD his palm was in front of the muzzle when he set the gun down. I think making guns easy to shoot has gone too far. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jsu6WsSQ2_g. What I can say is that article reads like a hit piece on the individuals who may or may not of made mistakes with their firearms from someone who worships at the alter of sig. They are being replaced with Glocks. who sells them? Happy with my old S&W revolvers, 3rd Gen S&W pistols,1911s and a slew of P226s. . Its the expert who gets caught up in the routine and stops paying attention. Asked if the guns in these cases could have been mishandled, Villani responds, When I see videos of police officers getting out of their car and their weapon discharges in their holsters, nah, theres a problem with the gun. ABC then ran bodycam footage of a pre-upgrade P320 firing as a Michigan state trooper exited his patrol car in 2016 with no mention of the results of any subsequent investigation. And as far as Special Forces go, SF going to Glock has been documented as a bean counters solution to save money. The thing I hate is getting kicked around! I dunno if its a case of lowest bidders blues or what. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. But were way past the days of major league, internationally known gunmakers turning out complete crap, selling it and the public living with it. Fair enough. abprototype.com can add the manual safety as well as add the notches in the grip frame. The safety WILL prevent the gun from firing with a trigger pull when activated, but it should never come to that. Sigs bid was low because they were still pissed after being beat by Beretta in cost. He takes your wallet and car and leaves the SIG. His haste to avoid the embarrassment of his gun being seen on the floor turned the incident from a wardrobe malfunction (accidental exposure of a concealed weapon, probably just a reprimand from the OPR) into a negligent discharge (the gun being fired led to him personally getting fired!). CBC News reached out to Sig Sauer and its Canadian distributor, M.D. SIG is choosing to litigate their problems away. And the fact they used real models, and big ones, gives the ships a real sense of heft, mass, movement and solidity that the garbage CGI ships of the new movies just cannot remotely compete with. I guess none got her the attention she wanted and a national coverage so she went in for the bang. The Defiant regardless of who is the captain. Hes like the arrogant star QB on your favorite football teamyeah, you would never want to spend a weekend with him at the lake cabin, but your franchise would be little to nothing without him. MIM strikers made in India and put into Sigs. Back in 2017, SIG instituted a voluntary upgrade program to replace the original production triggers with new enhanced triggers designed to fix the issue that we and others observed when the pistols were dropped onto hard surfaces. They've also been adopted as duty guns by law enforcement agencies across the country. Sig Sauer P220 Super Match. The Moron engineer who decided to put that on the Glock should have been hung by his dirty balls. The more someone touches, loads, clears, cleans, holsters, un-holsters, or otherwise deals with their firearm, the higher the statistical likelihood that complacence kicks in. This is the goal of those who would disarm us at the Post Office, as we take little Yevgeniy or little Shaquina to school, as we fulfill our civic responsibilities as jurors to judge our peers, as we travel to and through less free jurisdictions. People who know how to handle guns prudently and safely. Too Many Accidents The round went downrange so nobody was hurt. Dude, your story is THREE years old. After all, there are limits on complying with Rule 2 and even Rule 3, because a gun muzzle is ALWAYS covering something, somewhere, and ALWAYS knowing what lies beyondperhaps FAR beyonda possible target is an impossibility. Remember the highly trained FBI officer whose gun went off in a nightclub? Pity that some of the most common reactions fall into two over simplistic categories: 1. The weapon had a history of going off unexpectedly when it was dropped at a certain angle. Some of the plaintiffs claim the pistol can fire without the trigger even being touched. Theyve also been adopted as duty guns by law enforcement agencies across the country. Bagnell is representing a number of the police officers who have filed suits against SIG for un-commanded discharges, but wouldnt disclose the exact number. Bagnell also represented Virginia Sheriffs Deputy Marcie Vadnais who sued SIG when she said her P320 went off on its own when she was removing the weapon from her belt. Vadnais was featured in the Nightline version of ABCs report. Look a fanboy. 35446 Views 56 Replies 41 Participants Last post by tirod, Sep 1, 2021. Were not saying that the suits against GLOCK are any more (or less) substantiated than those against SIG. I wont argue theyre wrong, I dont own one, dont want to. We will respect the ongoing investigation and will not offer further comment at this time, Bineau said. If you want to find the lowest form of life on the planet interview any C.E.O. . Thinking its okay to wrap a loaded gun in a towel and toss it into a gym bag is what we get when departments refuse to hire candidates who score too high on IQ tests. Picard if Im limited to NCC-1701. Then theres the fact that the branches of the military have put the P320 design through their own batteries of testing and found it duty worthy. That could happen easily. But then Im not a federal LE flunky who cant keep my booger hook off the bang switch, either. Asking for a friend. Yes, conspiracy to defraud is a thing when ones @ss is on the line. Theyre the only product that is not. Im not even sure I would do that with my 92 or something else that can be both decocked and locked. Kyle . And I suspect at end of day this recent P320 one will be identified as a negligent discharge or from weapons from 2017 where owners failed to . Keep the phrase legal momentum in mind. He said hes a gun owner and a concealed carry permit holder. But SIG Sauer said it has rectified the issue with upgrades, including one made for the U.S. military which court documents, filed as part of one of the lawsuits, show resulted in substantial changes to the weapons internal design. Fourth, no one takes Taurus seriously. The P320 should be scrapped and SIG Sauer USA should redesign a new pistol around the striker firing mechanism instead of just retrofitting a hammer fired pistol (P250). NO, SIG has a problem that they would rather fight in court. This gun had been voluntary upgraded. This highly trained Fibbie was doing flips while dancing (breakdancing? Charlton, headquartered in Victoria, B.C., for comment on its original story, but neither responded. The American manufacturer of the new pistols belonging to Canadas special forces claims the soldier wounded in an accidental discharge last fall was using the wrong holster for the weapon. To give you an example of early self-propelled lawn mowers if you lost your grip on the handles the mower would not shut off and it would take off on its own right down the street all by itself. Plastic crap! The incident with the P320 - a contender for a major Canadian Armed Forces procurement of thousands of pistols and holsters that has a Aug. 3 deadline for industry proposals - occurred at JTF-2's Dwyer Hill training range just west of Ottawa. Without a loser pays tort system, such abuse will go on and on. Remember the stupidity of the far right is infinite and the blind greed of the gun makers prove they could not care less about human life and suffering. There are several stories about her in the news for various no reasons, she must be throwing them out by a dozen. I used to laugh at his bragging about how skilled he was with a weapon.. Its not credible to claim that people with this amount of training, this amount of skill are all shooting themselves.. The more someone touches, loads, clears, cleans, holsters, un-holsters, or otherwise deals with their firearm, the higher the statistical likelihood that complacence kicks in. Note also that ABC didnt provide any context for the number of suits filed against SIG. A fine of up to $10,000. If the gangster greed monger criminal Capitalvanians in the gun industry had their products under the jurisdiction of the consumer safety administration all the newer striker fired guns would never have been allowed on the market unless they had manual safeties and a safe take down system. Glocks biggest problem is they havent innovated since 1985. On Nov. 5, 2020, a recently-purchased SIG Sauer P320 pistol went off unexpectedly at a training range in Dwyer Hill, outside of Ottawa. But breaking news here, skippy. A plastic gun that has a tendency to go off by itself. Stinking Lawyers and quota cops. What it likely means is that cops and other law enforcement officers carry and handle their guns far more often than the average Joe or Jane. The second accidental shooting happened after police supervisors internally raised questions about the safety of the SIG Sauer P320. saw the video, doesnt explain how it bypasses striker pin safety. The SIG will be the shortest military contract for guns in history. Miraculously, no one was hit by the bullet, which ricocheted around inside the vehicle. Sounds like most of these cases were off-body carry. It may be a rotten trigger, but it does highlight the fact it has a much lighter trigger compared to classic semi-autos and revolvers. If it was so bad, why did the US Marines, who had the Glock, drop it in favor of the carry sized P320, the M18? In a straight up Glock vs. Sig battle, the United States Marines chose Sig, and that was AFTER watching the P320 perform for four years. So if, say, a person was to accidentally get shot through no fault of their own and need to sue, which specific cartridge/appendage combo would yield the most favorable least pain/permanent-damage : highest-payout ratio? My trust for Sig stopped after they produced the beloved Sig556xi Russian. Thread starter ut755ln; Start date Oct 19, 2022; Forums. A few Warbirds decloaking would make me very nervous if it wasnt sci-fi fantasy. One hell of a conspiracy. And they would not have done that for no reason at all. Effectively: you must be this dumb to get this job. And yes, if I pulled some of those stunts, Id have my membership revoked. three changes to the original design. This will include an alternate design that reduces the physical weight of the trigger, sear, and striker while additionally adding a mechanical disconnector. how do I get one for my P320? I still own them all. Too expensive to use their customers as beta testers. Canadas highly-trained counterterrorism force, JTF-2, is the only military unit with the SIG P320 in its inventory right now. SIG Sauer, a German weapons maker with its U.S. headquarters in Newington, N.H., issued a statement Friday in response to a CBC News report earlier this week that revealed the Nov. 5, 2020, incident and the fact the weapon, the SIG P320, had been withdrawn from service while the military conducts an investigation. This reminds me of when Gretchen Carlson sued Fox News for sexual harassment and she got 20 million dollars. . The cost of settlements will be passed on to us. At rest, cocked, it may very well have enough oomph to set some primers off. They did, however, note that when they were contacted by ABC, the company pointed out specific circumstances that were subsequently uncovered in the investigations of a number of these incidents. Had a buddy, years ago, that was a deputy for Orange County in California. The second version emphasized the upgrade to fix the drop safety issue and notes that Harrison believes that problem has been fixed. Oh, if you another thread reader asking Wheres the Sig/Glock bashing? The new Tauruses have a good rep, far better then the P320 or P365. I wish nothing bad on anyone carrying regardless of brand. If it were the guns, there would be thousands of cases involving citizensbut there arent. Ill go so far as to say the first batch of Sig P320s did nothing wrong. Theyve gotten tons of contracts because the gun is cheap, cheap, cheap to make. Third, Glock has had problems, too. The cheap seats were $100-$200 and you got to watch Wrath of Khan with Shatner. Dont quote the four rules of safety in your article when all the hotness in the gun world is appendix carry pointing something at an extremity and the photos you use showing front slide serrationsputting your hands fingers near the business end of the barrel, because press checks from the front is the way all the cool operator guys do it. To me it was unreal, $600 to ask a question about WOK and a picture. Again, these are examples the plaintiff in this case is using to support his claim that the P320 is prone to un-commanded discharges.. It was at that point that I knew the gun had a design flaw. And they think hey have an actual legit lawsuit on their hands? Bagnell told TTAG that he believes the problem with the striker-fired P320 is an inadequate sear/striker connection (he has images he says illustrate this on his website). At this point I would have to say that Taurus is a better handgun. It was expensive. Carrying a handgun in a purse, particularly one that isnt designed specifically to carry a firearm, is problematic at best. Yes, its reliable, but no more so than most other major brands well known models. They are plaintiffs versions of what they say happened. Im reading about a moron who wraps a loaded firearm in a cloth and stuff it in a gym bag, and other dumb behavior that tells me the weapon isnt the problem but the user. Canadian Special Forces Command has not said what caused the gun to go off unexpectedly, but the company said a conclusion has been reached. Who function tests their firearm 1) with a round in the chamber, and 2) when its pointed at an extremity? You did get to sit and watch it with him, which leads to a serious question. Sounds like these officers and others are attempting to cover their posteriors. Hilton has filed a $15 million lawsuit alleging the P320 has a serious design and manufacturing flaw. Hammer guns have a half cock notch for a reason. 3) If the sear fails, there is the drop safety in the way of the striker. After watching a friend get killed by a Remington 700 by another friend and the ensuing fallout 31 years ago I decided that I didnt care if the P320 was fixed, it was getting sold. And thats just my opinion. Police officers (maybe) do an annual qualification and thats it. If they recruit smart cops, they wont have cops who will act against their political opponents outside of the constitution. Hey, Im sitting here staring at my P320, waiting for it to go bang! Well I jumped in bed with ma and pa , told them that the devil was in Arkansas. SIG says ABC had intended to include some of those other claims in their reports, but after SIG informed the network of the additional information that was uncovered, those cases werent included in either of the segments. The Government mandated it to be made more safe to use and was. Is there any major military anywhere that ever issued one of their guns? The Glocks lack of a manual safety has caused untold thousands of needless cripplings and death. Depending on who you talk to you will get many different answers. https://millsentertainment.smugmug.com/William-Shatner-The-Wrath-of-Khan I dont own a P320. Guess it hasnt dawned on them that: 1. The same should hold true for the insane marketing of pistols like the totally unsafe Glock.